Ricoh C900

[Craig]

Keep in mind that the print engine may not be running slower, the processor is not ripping the job fast enough to keep up with the print engine. PPML will always be faster than PDF and PS because it will only rip the static information once.

[CMCRhonda]

Hi CMCRhonda,

Interesting. I have run VDP jobs on that device and noticed decreasing speed with complex jobs. However I got around it in using FreeForm. The device runs rated speed from the first page.
I also had huge performance gain by sending jobs down to the RIP as PPML.
The main factor is how intelligently applications send the information to the engine. Optimized PostScript can help a lot when printing huge VDP jobs. The C900 Fiery supports VPS and PPML so you might want to investigate down that track.
I assume you send the jobs from PP as optimized PostScript?
Do you have all the latest firmware and system software (v4) on your Fiery?
How much of your job is variable? Only the address line or do you swap images etc. as well? What does you Fiery tell you regarding free memory? How much does it have to work with? Quite certain you went through the standard switch off - switch on process, just to make sure

Would be happy to hear how you go.

Cheers
PrinterGuy

We send the job with PP as Optimized PostScript. The variable data is address block and occasional copy (visit your personal website, etc). We only have a few jobs pulling variable pdfs, and those are small enough (b&w) we run them on different equipment.

My main VDP issues have been with getting PP and the C900 communicating - I can't use the PP internal FreeForm consistently, and FreeForm2 won't work at all. PP returns an error that we don't have any memory - I'm not sure what you mean by standard switch off - switch on process - I would love to hear more. PP also supports VPS - I think I'll try that out, too.

Ikon did come do a big update, so I assume we have the most recent versions of everything. I will do some checking and verify. I also have started redistilling the PDFs and have met with success in speeding up our jobs, although with some loss of quality on the PDFs.

[CMCRhonda]

Keep in mind that the print engine may not be running slower, the processor is not ripping the job fast enough to keep up with the print engine. PPML will always be faster than PDF and PS because it will only rip the static information once.

This is indeed what we experience - the print engine doesn't start right away (self checks, etc) but very quickly catches up to the RIP - and then we wait.

I probably stated it wrong before - we are actually trying to speed up the RIP process, or optimize jobs for the C900 RIP.

[CMCRhonda]

How many prints do you have ? When I have seen this rebuilding the fuser has fixed it.

This happened from day one, so I don't think the fuser was bad. It's more like a substrate/toner issue. Some colors just don't look as nice as we expected, and we have returned to our Heidelberg for those jobs, even though they are short run (500 - 1000 pieces).

We are still also pursuing alternate stocks - using a matte stock versus a glossy basically fixes the problem (no oily look), but some customers are stubborn about using glossy stock lol...

[PrinterGuy]

Hi CMCRhonda,

With switch off - switch on process I mean switching the device off and powering it back on.
Are you using the right PPD within PP? You need to load the right PPD for the C900 Fiery in PP (you can extract the PPD from the PS driver you download on the Rioch web site).
Which version of PP are you using, 6 or 7?
In saying "I got rated speed using FreeForm" I mean the FreeForm on the Fiery. Send the master documents down to the Fiery and go to "Setup" -> "VDP" and then "create master".
When you print your large run you will have to go to thoses settings again and this time tell the printer to use that master for that job.
I could imagine your FreeForm and FreeForm2 within PP doesn't work because of issues with the PPD.
How did you set your document up? Virtual pages and cachable objects?
I'm sure the problem lies somewhere within those settings. The RIP is deafenetly fast enough to squirt some address lines into a document, no doubt!
What kind of network connection speed do you have there? Are you sure the data is getting to the RIP fast enough?
We'll get it sorted, at least I hope we do.

Cheers
PrinterGuy

[msaeger]

This happened from day one, so I don't think the fuser was bad. It's more like a substrate/toner issue. Some colors just don't look as nice as we expected, and we have returned to our Heidelberg for those jobs, even though they are short run (500 - 1000 pieces).

We are still also pursuing alternate stocks - using a matte stock versus a glossy basically fixes the problem (no oily look), but some customers are stubborn about using glossy stock lol...

Well even if you have gotten it since day one it could still be a problem with the fuser there has been updates. I'm sure you played with all the different paper type settings they do make a big difference.

Yeah matte is better than gloss on every laser printer in my experience the people always want to use gloss though. I think maybe they think they will get something like a photo printed on a dye sub or something.

[msaeger]

Ikon did come do a big update, so I assume we have the most recent versions of everything. I will do some checking and verify. I also have started redistilling the PDFs and have met with success in speeding up our jobs, although with some loss of quality on the PDFs.

4.0 is the latest fiery system software. It will say the version on the op panel under the fiery tab or on the config page.

[PrinterGuy]

Regarding the PP speed issue.
Is your C900 a licensed PS device within PP? I recall that having impact on the ability to cach information on the printer itself.
How do you send the jobs down to the printer anyway? "Print using windows driver..." or "Print..."? Any workflow hooked up to the process?
Is "PP Production" involved in the process? Maybe you can tell us a little about how you build your documents (Page Properties, Document Properties - Resource options etc.)?


Cheers
PrinterGuy

[CMCRhonda]

Regarding the PP speed issue.
Is your C900 a licensed PS device within PP? I recall that having impact on the ability to cach information on the printer itself.
How do you send the jobs down to the printer anyway? "Print using windows driver..." or "Print..."? Any workflow hooked up to the process?
Is "PP Production" involved in the process? Maybe you can tell us a little about how you build your documents (Page Properties, Document Properties - Resource options etc.)?


Cheers
PrinterGuy

We use PP 7 (upgraded recently) with the Production Workflow. We do not have an individual license specifically for the Ricoh (Production is the new Server version...). We do design for the Ricoh PPD, not a generic PPD.

We use Virtual pages for the personalization, and the "regular" page for the PDF. I had not worked with the overlay options previously.

I have been using Freeform or generic cacheing - freeform did speed us up some, but also requires sending the master and slave seperate. Freeform 2 won't work at all. Generic cacheing was too slow. From your comments, I looked more into VPS and tried that. I think the major difference there is using the "overlay" for the PDF.

Creating the same file as a VPS, and adding the PDFs to an "overlay" page and adding cacheing to the overlay has reduced the total file size after ripping from 507.8 MB to 48.8 MB. The speed on this particular job is hard to guage, as it's only 66 pages (12x18) after ripping - but I shaved it from over 4 minutes to under 3 minutes. I think the file size indicates a definite improvement. I'm excited to try this on a larger file.

One thing I noticed - the soft proof doesn't seem to work with VPS, it won't distill a PDF - that's not a huge issue, we can work around it, but if anyone knows why (possibly something I am doing wrong) that would be cool.

Thanks for your insights - I'll try to update my progress.

Rhonda

[ShortRunMagazines]

Seems like there is a couple of C900 owners on here... I run primarily 80# and 100# Gloss Text 4/4 high coverage and am looking at this machine. We run Magazines, low quantity but high page volume per order (upwards of 15k clicks/order) so this machine, on paper, looks like the best fit short of an Indigo or IGen. What are your thoughts on the box? What service interval are you seeing? Is the RIP Stable?

Thanks,

Jerod.