FSC certification

[kdonegan]

Hi
We are researching becoming FSC certified. We are a digital print facility w/ revs < 1million.
Smartwood budget estimate was $7100.
I thought I have heard others mention $3-5k. Any info appreciated.
Thanks
Kevin

[Green Printer]

What does the certification do for you?

[bprint]

We did ours through Smartwood last year and I think I remember it being around $4,000. There is yearly maintenance for 5 years. The $7,100 could be the $3-4k plus the yearly fee over 5 years and they are showing what the total would be over that time. It took a long time for us to get certified. I would be sure to get another quote, maybe SCS.

[kdonegan]

I inquired with Smartwood and they resonded that the price is higher as they have had to increase to cover internal costs.....

[Craig]

What does the certification do for you?

It's legalized extortion, think about it. Your going to pay 7 grand so you can print a stupid logo, keep a separate inventory, tracking information, and all the rest of the hoops you need to jump through. Then there are maintenance fees too!!!

God I wish I would have thought of it!

[kdonegan]

indeed, would like to create a disclaimer that says we adhere to all the FSC guidelines BUT we can't print the logo because we sent the money to UNICEF instead.
I'm sure it began with good intentions but now it's about making some $$$

[Craig]

indeed, would like to create a disclaimer that says we adhere to all the FSC guidelines BUT we can't print the logo because we sent the money to UNICEF instead.
I'm sure it began with good intentions but now it's about making some $$$

Not a bad idea actually, it would make for a good conversation starter with a potential customer. I think folks can see through this kind of crap for the most part, at least I hope.

I'm all for a cleaner environment, and am doing my part, but the next time a tree huger complains, I'll ask them if they ever wiped with synthetic toilet paper.

[mattf]

Not a bad idea actually, it would make for a good conversation starter with a potential customer. I think folks can see through this kind of crap for the most part, at least I hope.

I'm all for a cleaner environment, and am doing my part, but the next time a tree huger complains, I'll ask them if they ever wiped with synthetic toilet paper.

Many customers do not see through it. Our company is about a month away from an audit and we have customers left and right asking about if we have been certified yet. Its kind of ridiculous.

But what are ya gonna do? I wouldn't want to lose a $300K a year account just because we didn't take the time to do a silly certification.

[hughg@sfcooper.com]

I heard FSC just changed to a "3 year minimum" deal, probably to "lock in" those who pay $$$ to get Certified.... because many are reporting NOT getting much of any increase in new "green" sales these days (and FSC is probably facing declining "printer fees" as more 'drop out' or close). No one wants to lose a good account, but these days "costs" really matter, and FSC Certification expense (which is based upon, for no logical reason, a printer's employee "head count") goes on year/year. While many printers desperate to market themsleves in tough times still believe "greenwashing" alone will help them survive, others are telling customers a fundamental truth: "We can and do buy and use FSC papers all the time, but we're reluctant to pay thousands per year to FSC simply for the priviledge of printing their logo...because our customers are telling us they'd prefer we keep our costs - and their prices - as low as possible right now. We think your decision to use FSC papers is GREAT, and we're pleased to do that, but we suggest this really isn't the time to 'add cost.'

Those print buyers more concerned about "appearance" than substance...have already drunk FSC's Koolaid and are unlikely to drop their logo demands. Their primary concern is "branding themselves" Green, and "simply doing the right thing" isn't enough to satisfy them. The cost of "getting" or "keeping"
these may make sense, but think carefully. If you sign on to a multi-year deal...and that customer
"goes away" for any reason in this economy, you could be stuck with non-recoverable costs at the worst possible time.

[mattf]

I heard FSC just changed to a "3 year minimum" deal, probably to "lock in" those who pay $$$ to get Certified.... because many are reporting NOT getting much of any increase in new "green" sales these days (and FSC is probably facing declining "printer fees" as more 'drop out' or close). No one wants to lose a good account, but these days "costs" really matter, and FSC Certification expense (which is based upon, for no logical reason, a printer's employee "head count") goes on year/year. While many printers desperate to market themsleves in tough times still believe "greenwashing" alone will help them survive, others are telling customers a fundamental truth: "We can and do buy and use FSC papers all the time, but we're reluctant to pay thousands per year to FSC simply for the priviledge of printing their logo...because our customers are telling us they'd prefer we keep our costs - and their prices - as low as possible right now. We think your decision to use FSC papers is GREAT, and we're pleased to do that, but we suggest this really isn't the time to 'add cost.'

Those print buyers more concerned about "appearance" than substance...have already drunk FSC's Koolaid and are unlikely to drop their logo demands. Their primary concern is "branding themselves" Green, and "simply doing the right thing" isn't enough to satisfy them. The cost of "getting" or "keeping"
these may make sense, but think carefully. If you sign on to a multi-year deal...and that customer
"goes away" for any reason in this economy, you could be stuck with non-recoverable costs at the worst possible time.

Thanks for your input.

Our customers of course are worried about costs within this economy, but there are many industries that are requiring their jobs to run on paper that is Chain of Custody certified. We deal with many who are heading in that direction, so its logical for us to stay ahead of the curve and get certified. I completely understand your view of customers and businesses reducing immediate un-needed costs, but the fact remains some industries do not have an option to NOT use certified paper. Sadly, our print company deals with a lot of those industries.

Putting forward a mindset to customers on how to manage their projects is a nice little thing, but when you deal with certain industries, and its not just print buyers, a lot of times they have no choice. Government work is a great example, state and federal. Same with certain education, financial and medical institutions.